From marketing to discovering passion in organisational development

Jaka: Herman, I appreciate your time and you coming in. I would love to hear about your journey. Could you tell me how you ended up in people and culture from the very beginning?

Herman: Let me go through the high-level points. Actually, I'm not starting my career in HR. I'm starting my career on the marketing side because I graduated in management, specifically business management, not in HR.

For the first two and a half years, I spent my time on the marketing side. However, at the moment, I remember I love organisational development (OD) aspect, a part of the HR department. That is why I am joining the HR function, not because of HR itself, but because I can be more productive on the OD side.

The reason why I have loved being in OD is that if I look back at the last ten years, especially during junior high school, I was involved quite a lot in student activities. For almost ten years, I've been joining organisations within the accounting field.

I love to develop and build relationships with people, learn how to manage them, and find effective and efficient ways of doing things, among other things. That's basically why I started to love the OD side.

Then, my career actually began. I spent almost eight years in compensation and benefits (C&B). I also worked on several other projects, such as merging information and OD investments. I worked on many mixed projects due to the merger and transformation at that time. That's why I stayed in HR for quite some time, around ten years in my first company.

The first ten years are for me to learn and build my capabilities. After that, I moved on to the second company, which is also in the banking industry. I apply what I learned during the last ten years to become the VP at the second company. The third bank is doing the same thing, but almost 70% of the larger functions that I manage in the third bank are under my supervision.

After spending several years in HR, I can say that I am more of an HR generalist with some specialist and CNB experience. Then, Gojek took me out of banking and into a startup, which was very unstructured and unconventional, as startups tend to be.

In a startup, what I actually learned from the conventional way is that the knowledge I gained is like a foundation that I can use in a startup. I often ask why we are doing things a certain way, which may seem strange. I struggled a lot during the first six months and wondered if I had joined the right company. I can only imagine how it must have been for others.

Because the system is very complex, it keeps changing constantly. It's different from the conventional banking sector, which is structured and has clear targets. However, in Gojek, there are no set targets. You need to be creative on your own, using your skills and resources to make things work and keep the wheel spinning in the right direction. For me, it's a struggle.

After 15 years in HR, did I become the least intelligent person in the company? However, what I learned from my previous 15 years in the company provided me with the fundamental knowledge I needed for HR. I just focused on the fundamental aspects of the job.

That's one part on the current side. The second part is about why I became a lecturer at the university. One of my mentors told me, "Look, you are already there. You have already been successful in your career. This is the time for you to give back to the university and teach the younger generation. It's part of your social responsibility to give back to the university and to teach these young students." That's why I'm going back to the university - to teach the younger generation and show them how Indonesia teaches its students.

It's a very conventional way of attending class. However, there are only a few practitioners in the market who return to university to share their stories, experiences, and explanations, not just from the book. In Indonesia, they only teach what's written in the book. I believe that students can also read and benefit from this approach.

Those are the two reasons why I chose my career path: my passion for teaching and my interest in working with people from different cultures. I hope to become a head of HR or a similar position someday, but it's not something I'm actively pursuing. It's just that people trust me to take on such a role, and I never asked for it. They asked me to help build the organisation, and that's why I took the position.

For me, a title is just a title, but my mission is not about the title. I care more about the people who work within the organisation. Many startup employees have an entrepreneurial skill set. They already know what they are good at, but as the leader, I need to ensure that they are not only skilled in one area.

They should have many things that can be developed as long as they are willing to develop them. Therefore, for me, it is more important to focus on the growth of individuals, rather than the position I hold or the title of my site.

They should have many things that can be developed as long as they are willing to develop them. Therefore, for me, it is more important to focus on the growth of individuals, rather than the position I hold or the title of my site.

Creating trust and being culturally sensitive during change management

Jaka: In that particular context, I can totally relate to it. That is exactly why I think leaders like you were scouted by Gojek to take care of the HRBP back then.

Because that's exactly the main problem. It used to be very fixated on certain titles without focusing on what the organisation needs and how the talent itself wants to be nurtured, essentially.

What resources or support do you wish HR professionals had when it comes to restructuring or change management? Have you seen much support for Southeast Asia startups?

Herman: Restructuring or change management is an extremely complex and lengthy process. Intrinsic to the success of any change management is trust; before implementing any kind of change, there needs to be a foundation of established trust between the employees and the organisation. Once the change initiative has been carefully designed and planned, how we communicate to the employees and strengthen that bedrock of trust is critical - and there are two components to this that require support.

First, on top of providing clarity on what the change is going to be and how it will be implemented, we need to be able to comprehensively explain the context for change. What is the purpose of implementing the change? How will it benefit the organisation in the long run?

As HR professionals, we should be well-equipped to answer questions and provide accurate information to build trust. The second component is impact - we need to be able to articulate what’s in it for the employees and why they should care, making sure we address every concern through a structured process characterized by transparency and compassion in order to alleviate anxiety.

As for the second question, the type of support Southeast Asian startups need varies based on the unique context of each company. Generally, the cultural diversity of Southeast Asia calls for a culturally sensitive and inclusive approach built into the change management strategies.

Generally, the cultural diversity of Southeast Asia calls for a culturally sensitive and inclusive approach built into the change management strategies.

This extends to the way change is being communicated to the employees. Also, the need to pivot fast to keep up with dynamic market trends in the region is prevalent, so the support I mentioned earlier needs to be boosted as change is going to be a constant.

Preparation and adaptation: HR’s role in developing talent after restructuring

Jaka: In what ways can HR be even more strategic with talent development after a restructuring or organisational transformation?

Herman: Ideally, the renewed initiatives for talent development need to be in place before any organisational transformation, as part of the company’s change management strategy. This would help prepare the workforce and ensure they are properly equipped with the right skills and capabilities ahead of the new direction.

In reality, however, after an organisational transformation, the workforce is often forced to adjust to the new ways of working - there is little to no time for formal development. How HR can be more strategic, then, is to adopt a multifaceted approach that assumes the role of a coach to help the workforce more effectively adapt to change.

How HR can be more strategic, then, is to adopt a multifaceted approach that assumes the role of a coach to help the workforce more effectively adapt to change.

This means HR needs to be more proactively engaging with managers to understand what the pain points or challenges are and, as required, facilitate conversations between the managers and team members as a neutral party to resolve the issue.

HR can also offer individual counseling sessions to employees who may be experiencing heightened stress, anxiety or concerns due to the organisational transformation. To further create a supportive environment for peer-sharing, HR can facilitate group counseling sessions where employees can feel safe and empowered to express their feelings without judgment.

Using learning as a tool to manage risk in dynamic environments

Jaka: What do you see as the role of learning in helping startups navigate constant change and disruption?

Herman: As startups typically have to navigate uncertainty and disruption due to rapidly evolving market dynamics, continuous learning is key to helping employees not only adapt but also thrive in a startup environment.

The most critical role learning plays is the development of a growth mindset in employees. A growth mindset is the belief that one can develop their skills and talents through hard work and practice and that embracing challenges and failures paves the way to eventual success.

The most critical role learning plays is the development of a growth mindset in employees. A growth mindset is the belief that one can develop their skills and talents through hard work and practice and that embracing challenges and failures paves the way to eventual success.

Driven by resilience and grit, learning enables startups to make better-informed decisions, manage risks more effectively, and recover from setbacks more quickly. With a strong growth mindset, employees will be able to recognise the importance of upskilling themselves to enable them to expand or even change their roles in a fast-changing startup environment.

Putting together a blueprint for personal and professional development

Jaka: What's in store for you in the year ahead? How would you like to grow professionally and personally?

Herman: I always encourage my team to step out of their comfort zone, because we all know the compelling benefits and opportunities it provides. I believe it’s high time I heed that advice myself in the year ahead.

Stepping into unfamiliar territory can be especially daunting for senior leaders, for several reasons: the pressure to maintain our reputation; the loss of expertise if we’re venturing into new domains; the struggle of balancing our existing responsibilities with the demands of leaving our comfort zone; and, most pertinent of all, the vulnerability of putting aside our ego when we step into unfamiliar territory where we are no longer tied to our expertise and accomplishments.

However, in today’s rapidly evolving business landscape, I can no longer sit still; I need to defeat my own fear and step out of my comfort zone for my professional and personal growth - and I look forward to embracing discomfort for an improved, braver version of myself.